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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #1
I have about a dozen phoenix. Nine of those are rejects; really not suitable for breeding. So when I got these two pullets (first two pictures) I was thrilled. I'm hoping to have a small flock that I can show with pride. The third picture is the father and the fourth picture is my red and black phoenix.
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OK, I'm confused. Those girls have some amazing tails on them. Is that normal? Are the girls from your breeding program?

Want to do some teaching? Post pics of those undesirables to see if we can pick out what isn't suitable. That's probably something we all should have doing right from the start. We all know what to look for for the most part but not what to stay away from.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #3
OK, I'm confused. Those girls have some amazing tails on them. Is that normal? Are the girls from your breeding program?
They are from my breeding program. Almost all the phoenix I have seen were pictures and none of the hen/pullet pictures showed females with such nice tails. Their mother has a nice tail, but not nearly as long.
Want to do some teaching? Post pics of those undesirables to see if we can pick out what isn't suitable. That's probably something we all should have doing right from the start. We all know what to look for for the most part but not what to stay away from.
This was a reject and was sold as such, so tell me why I sold him.

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Tail and tail set? Can't tell because he's on alert but too upright of a posture? That would be the two things I don't find pleasing to the eye.

From there I'm stuck because I don't know what is acceptable in the Phoenix.

Even as a reject he's someone's delightful lawn ornament with his color.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #5
Tail and tail set? Can't tell because he's on alert but too upright of a posture? That would be the two things I don't find pleasing to the eye.

From there I'm stuck because I don't know what is acceptable in the Phoenix.

Even as a reject he's someone's delightful lawn ornament with his color.
Actually he was not on alert.

You have a good eye. Phoenix are supposed to be pheasant-like so yes, he is too upright, tail carried too high when it should be horizontal and down. His comb is not well defined.

I sold him because of the carriage and tail. The faulty comb I considered minor.

The picture shows my red pair. While they look great their chicks have all been flawed. My white pair has produced a number of great offspring. I'm planning on putting the two white pullets with the red roo in the picture when they start to lay.
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The gold roo was beautiful and I hesitated in selling. I even tried him as a breeder a number of times. None of the chicks turned out better and most were not as good.

 

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I don't know if it's a good eye or my personal preferences. But considering what I raised I guess that doesn't work either.

Combs I never worried about too much because they could be easily fixable. Other stuff could be tough. Especially if there wasn't a plethora of different breeding choices.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #7
I don't know if it's a good eye or my personal preferences. But considering what I raised I guess that doesn't work either.
Either way, you were right on with your observations.
Combs I never worried about too much because they could be easily fixable. Other stuff could be tough. Especially if there wasn't a plethora of different breeding choices.
Whether it be phoenix, serama, cochin, call... I single out just a couple flaws to work on in any program. Trying to fix everything at once is a recipe for disappointment if not impossible. For me, a nonshow person, only the flaws I find disturbing are concerns. Possibly, in time, I may go more for those show quality traits.
 

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I've seen Silkies I wouldn't give a plug nickel for they were so over bred for a particular trait. I learned early on to trust my eyes. If I liked it then it was good enough.

There are some things not to mess with, wry tail is one. Because I had heard all these nonsense things when it came to raising or breeding I decided to test it. Oh boy, that one will cross right over to the peeps. There were a couple of others that I tested and found the issue easily fixable.

That's where I think we're really on our own when it comes to making breeding choices. Old wives tales still exist or breeders just are not forthcoming.
 

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They're beautiful Dan! All of them for various reasons- but I can see why you sold the other guy. I would've just said his body seemed long compared to what you're after- but you both said it so much better! His colors really were beautiful tho. Those two little white pullets tho- so cute!
 

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I've seen Silkies I wouldn't give a plug nickel for they were so over bred for a particular trait. I learned early on to trust my eyes. If I liked it then it was good enough.

There are some things not to mess with, wry tail is one. Because I had heard all these nonsense things when it came to raising or breeding I decided to test it. Oh boy, that one will cross right over to the peeps. There were a couple of others that I tested and found the issue easily fixable.

That's where I think we're really on our own when it comes to making breeding choices. Old wives tales still exist or breeders just are not forthcoming.
Absolutely!
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #11
I've seen Silkies I wouldn't give a plug nickel for they were so over bred for a particular trait. I learned early on to trust my eyes. If I liked it then it was good enough.

There are some things not to mess with, wry tail is one. Because I had heard all these nonsense things when it came to raising or breeding I decided to test it. Oh boy, that one will cross right over to the peeps. There were a couple of others that I tested and found the issue easily fixable.

That's where I think we're really on our own when it comes to making breeding choices. Old wives tales still exist or breeders just are not forthcoming.
It is hard to find good and accurate information when it comes to breeding, so I would assume you are correct in that many breeders are hush-hush.

Terrible day! The neighbor's dog got into the poultry yard and coops. Six of my Calls are gone; I found four bodies. When I'm a bit calmer I'll look to see what else is gone. Peafowl and the turkeys all flew to the roofs, trees, and high perches. Only 6 Calls left.
 

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I am so sorry, Dan. It's one of the most difficult things to have to deal with when something goes wrong with our birds.

Will you approach them about replacing the birds? Since I didn't have to deal with any of that while I was in TN I don't know if calling the law is worth it. They'll tell you to shoot the dog. They'll go to the owners and tell them that you are within your rights to shoot it.

All I can suggest is hot wire around the pens. For you that would be tough because you'll be leaving them on all of the time and have to step over wires.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #13
I talked with the neighbors last night. They do not believe the ducks/birds would be $50+ each to replace. I told them to look online. They know I will shoot the dog the minute it gets on my land. End of story.

Something more pleasant-I candled the 4 cochin eggs I set 4 days ago and all 4 are developing. When the cochin hens go broody, I can look forward to chicks. Both cochin hens are laying.
 

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Good. Now let's see if they do something to prevent you having to shoot it.

My fingers are crossed you get some nice babies to use in a breeding program.
 

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I talked with the neighbors last night. They do not believe the ducks/birds would be $50+ each to replace. I told them to look online. They know I will shoot the dog the minute it gets on my land. End of story.

Something more pleasant-I candled the 4 cochin eggs I set 4 days ago and all 4 are developing. When the cochin hens go broody, I can look forward to chicks. Both cochin hens are laying.
I am so sorry for your loss Dan, I've been there.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #16
A phoenix hen is hatching her own eggs today. She is 7/8ths phoenix, 1/8th white crested Polish paired to a full phoenix. When I got rid of most of my mixed phoenix I kept her because she was to pretty to part with. I'm hoping some of the chicks have her coloration and the low hanging tail of the phoenix. When the hatch is complete I will post pictures.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #18
Four new chicks. What records I have show that I remembered the hen's background incorrectly. She is 1/16th white crested Polish-1/2 Yokohama-7/16ths phoenix; an interesting mix!

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This is getting even more interesting to see what characteristics are going to show in the little ones.
 

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Serama King
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Discussion Starter #20
I'm hoping for the mom's color on a phoenix body. but I'm not sure which phoenix roo is the dad. Not all my roos are good in the looks department. All the phoenix are free ranging at this time. For this hen's next clutch I'll have her set up with my best white phoenix rooster. While I like phoenix, they do not come in a lot of different colors, so I'll just have to create the colors combos I want. It doesn't show in the picture that the hen is snow white on the breast and underside.
 
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